Episode 83: Mahara Mindfulness
Living in Alignment with Mahara Mindfulness co-founders Sheba Zaidi and Genevive Savundranayam
This week Samantha chats with the co-founders of Mahara Mindfulness Genevieve Savundranayagam & Sheba Zaidi. Their shared belief in the power of mindfulness and how it can improve our mental health inspired them to launch Mahara in early 2020. They have years of experience in meditation, breath-work, energy healing and so much more with led them to deeply understand the power of integrating mindfulness into your daily life.
The three discuss living in alignment, finding purpose, and the meaning of "flow" in business.
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Podcast Script
Samantha: [00:00:00] Monetize your passion for wellbeing. Like a job you love every single day and design a happy life from a healthy lifestyle. What's up guys. This is thin skin and other addictions of podcast by me, Samantha E Cutler of the fit for town each week. I'm going to take you deeper into the world of wellness with entrepreneurs who are building brands designed to better your life.
[00:00:26] So you'll be hearing from fitness gurus, medical specialists and influencers in the world of fitness, health, beauty, and nutrition. I hope you guys love it.
Genevive: [00:00:43] What do you want from your life? Like tell the universe, this is what I envisioned my life to be and articulate that very clearly, because once you have that clear idea and that vision, then that you get to that point where you will be able to make that decision. And it's, I [00:01:00] agree, like you have no idea where that decision is going to take you, but you're actually then very intentional about the course that you're taking,
Samantha: [00:01:07] Your listening to you, spin skin and other addictions episode number 83 this week is such a beautiful episode around mindfulness and creating products that make a difference.
[00:01:22] I started this podcast with the idea in mind that humans are instinctively good. They want to create, and they want to help. They want to change the lives of those around them. And I believe that businesses succeed when they do that successfully. I am a big believer that if you have philanthropic mission associated with your product or, or, or project or brand, or company, or, or platform that you really do have the world and the universe behind you, it's all about the purpose of your why.
[00:01:56] So today's episode just reinforces that message [00:02:00] and I'm so thrilled to bring it to all of you for my 83rd episode today, I'm joined by Sheba and Genevive , the co-founders and female. Boss ladies of mindfulness and, and thought-provoking content, their product, the human being journal part of Mahara mindfulness is a beautiful journal that invites humans to really think about what's going on for them, how they feel reflect on their daily life and gratitude as a whole.
[00:02:29] So we all know about gratitude, journaling and how much that changes our mindset, but within the human being journal, because I have one myself and I love it. You actually are provoked with questions that are tough. They're, they're reflecting on gratitude, but also what is your journey? And what's your purpose and your why and how does each layer and each component of your life impact that.
[00:02:52] So we dive into today, really the unique stories of Gen and Sheba, both so different and so unique and experience, but also so whole, and their similarities come together in. Creating a product that changes the lives of the people who use it. And that is why I built this podcast. So they are really just the epitome of the perfect guests and they're such beautiful women inside and out that, that light and that success has continued to ripple.
[00:03:24] So just as a little example, they're now in Indigo after launching about two and a half, three months ago or so, which is crazy, but better yet. They're also featured on Oprah's favorite things, remind wellness products. Can you believe that imagine two or three months after launching Oprah, has you on her, the list of favorite things that just means that your intention and your purpose behind what you're creating are so aligned that you're serving the greater good.
[00:03:51] And I really, really, really do believe this when it comes to products that, that ripples so far beyond your control and when good [00:04:00] and, and good intentions are. Present when you're building something, it just flourishes into something that you can't even imagine. And all that to say, I'm so excited to hear from Gen and Sheba today, I will let you guys hear from our guests and how much insight they bring to this podcast, but I hope you enjoy this episode is one of my absolute favorites that we recorded.
[00:04:24] And without further ado, I will introduce our guests today. Hello everyone. And welcome back to another episode of spin skin and other addictions. You know, that I am a big fan of journaling and also of mindfulness. So our guests today are kind of the perfect combo to dive into both of those topics. I am joined by the co-founders of Mahara mindfulness, the creator of the human being journal Sheba, and Gen and I am so excited to have them here today on the podcast.
[00:04:56] As we dive into everything that these two female [00:05:00] powerhouse entrepreneurs are about and how mindfulness has been a big component of building their business. So welcome Sheba and Gen, thank you for being here and having this time with me today, I will let you introduce yourself to our listeners. Perfect.
Sheba: [00:05:12] Well, thank you so much for having us on the podcast, Sam, and it's so funny because just before this, we were emailing and I was like, I cannot call you Samantha. You're totally sound to me. So it's so nice to be on and to sort of have this conversation in terms of talking about Mahara mindfulness and how it all came about.
[00:05:31] I know we'll get into it a little bit more, but just want to sort of set the pace and like give you a little bit of background on like, you know, how we sort of arrived here and I'll go first, Gen, and then you can jump in. So just a little bit of context for like how
[00:05:45] Gen and I even met. So I was born in Canada.
[00:05:48] I moved to the middle East when I was three years old. So I grew up in a country called Oman and my parents are Pakistani. And so I, you know, from the age of [00:06:00] five to 18, I went to an international school and I always sort of. Plug this detail because it's been so informative in terms of who I became as a person and my worldview and sort of the things that are important to me.
[00:06:14] And so just to like provide some context around that. So we have like 800 kids in our school and 65 nationalities represented. And so from such a formative age, like for me, like race and profession and borders, none of that mattered. And it was all always about like connecting with another human being.
[00:06:33] And so after I graduated, I moved back to Canada, went to McGill and did two different degrees and then was in New York for a little bit and did an internship at the United nations, came back, moved to Toronto and then started sort of a decade long career in communications and PR. And so like, I love storytelling.
[00:06:53] I love, like I said, connecting with people. And while I was at the agency, I met Gen [00:07:00] and we'll sort of get into that story in a little bit, but while sort of Gen and I had those corporate careers, me and Gen and another girlfriend of ours, Aaron started a side hustle. Why will we were still working called the County wine tours?
[00:07:15] And it is aligned to our company based out of Prince Edward County. And so why that was so sort of instrumental in our journey is because while we had full-time gigs, it gave us that taste of what entrepreneurship would feel like, even though it was a seasonal business and it's actually still operational or moving into our fifth year, but it really got our feet wet.
[00:07:36] And I think it gave us that like push Gen and I eventually needed when we went full-time into entrepreneurship in early 2020, but I'll let sort of Gen jump in and tell you a little bit about her and then we can talk about Mahara more
Genevive: [00:07:49] . Okay. So to echo what Sheba said, thank you so much, Sam, for having us on we're so excited to chat with you.
[00:07:55]So I'm Genevieve and the other co-founder of mohara. And [00:08:00] for me, prior to launching mohara, my experience has been primarily working in marketing and communications over a decade from advertising agencies to helping start PR firms. And I would say the most meaningful work experience for me was having worked at UNICEF.
[00:08:16]It's an incredible organization and because that's very close to my heart, so it really sort of shaped a lot of what matters to me most now. And I think as we build out Mahara and into the future as a global business When I'm not working, I'm always traveling. I'm a very curious person. It's one of the reasons I think Sheba and I connected very quickly, you know, love to travel, love, learning about other people's life experiences and really understanding human behavior and so much.
[00:08:45] I think for me as well, I wasn't born in Canada. I was born in Sri Lanka. My family and I left when I was six years old due to the civil war. So I didn't have a typical childhood growing up, but I learned very early on the importance of [00:09:00] mindfulness and connecting to your spirit and really the strength that comes from that.
[00:09:03]And being able to. See that play out in my life has been really interesting. And what I find now that's been a true gift, is really building Mahara and merging all of these experiences together and taking it another step further and being able to give back to the world in a really meaningful way, merging Sheba experiences, my experiences, and for us being very global and thinking about just people as human beings is really important for us.
[00:09:31] So I'll just a little bit about me and I think Sheba , why don't you dive in and share a little more about how we met and connected?
Sheba: [00:09:39] Yeah, so obviously, you know, like we talked about, we sort of had this PR communications career in our, now it feels like our former life, even though we only left at a year ago.
[00:09:49] So that's where I met Gen. And, you know, even though Gen and I were sort of on different teams, I did sort of healthcare PR. Gen was more on the corporate side. We just really always connected [00:10:00] when it came to our spirit and this idea of Really cultivating mindfulness practices in our life. And so, you know, even though Mahara has only been, you know, it launched two and a half months ago, we've been creating it for the past year, but really I say Mahara was built a decade ago because it really has been a journey.
[00:10:18] And I think it's really interesting for us because at the core of it, so Gen and I actually both came from religious families and general that you sort of speak to your relationship with religion and growing up with that. But for me, what happened was I grew up in a religious household, but I, from a very young age, remember rejecting, organized religion.
[00:10:38] Like for me, it never felt real and it never landed.
Samantha: [00:10:41] That's super interesting. I have a similar experience actually.
Sheba: [00:10:45] Yeah. And so what happened for me though, is. I'm so thankful. I grew up in a family like that and you know, my parents were super progressive and totally allowed us the like space to question religion.
[00:10:57] And, you know, we were allowed to have our own ideas, but [00:11:00] what it did for me is it planted the seed of spirituality and this idea of. There's something bigger and I was always a seeker. And so for me, even though yes, organized religion, wasn't going to be part of my life. Spirituality a hundred percent was going to be the bedrock of my life.
[00:11:18] And it has been foundational for me and has been an anchor. And so when Gen and I met, you know, there was this like instant, energy and faith and knowing your place in the world and that no one else has to inform that, like, you know, you come from the world and you come from this earth and that you will find your way as you navigate, but that's a really powerful thing.
[00:11:42] And I always tell my parents this, like, thank you for like, not forcing religion on me, but thank you for giving me that platform to have faith and to go seek it out myself. And so, you know, through the years, you know, Gen and I have meditated and been avid journalists and experimented with breath work [00:12:00] and psychedelics and read like, just been like students of life and like, you know, Pema children and Michael Beckwith.
[00:12:07] Cause we just wanted to like, yes, we had our careers in our lives, but like that was such a huge part of our inner world and such a huge part of. You know, just when things are hard, right? Like we talked about like mental health and when you're lost and you don't always have the answers, it was always the place that I knew was mine and I could go back to, and it just, it has always informed so much.
[00:12:33] And so Mahara came from that, but Gen, ill let you sort of talk a little bit about your relationship of religion.
Samantha: [00:12:39] And just to echo that a little bit Sheba, it's interesting. Cause it's the sense of believing in a higher self and that there's, you know, a greater good out there that guides you through life.
[00:12:52] And that is what you guys, the two of you really represent as co-founders, but also within you know, the human being journal. And that's what it is. [00:13:00] It's about being human and understanding your connection. To the ground, to the world that you live in and that ultimately at the end of it, where energy and it's funny, because last night I was just sharing, actually, we got this poster above our bed that says like in any lifetime, I will find you like Trevor and I always say that to each other. And it's all about, it's not about me in this form or you in that form or whatever it is it's about love is undestructible energy is indestructable and ultimately it just repurposes. And I think , it's beautiful, your relationship with that. Yeah, Gen, I'd love to hear a little bit of your story and, and how I guess spirituality cultivated within you, so naturally.
[00:13:40] Genevive: [00:13:40] Yeah. So I grew up in a very religious household as well. So Catholic parents and going to church every Sunday. And for me, it was something that actually really embraced religion. In the sense I enjoyed that Sunday was a time that we spent together as a family. We prayed together as a family.
[00:13:57] And I think so much of [00:14:00] my life growing up was it was very, it was a very difficult life. So it was a way to have hope and a way to find your center was when you're feeling a bit scared or you don't know where you're going to be tomorrow, you just pray. So I think for me, it was a very special thing to have religion in my life.
[00:14:19] I think over time, I was similar to Sheba, seeker. I've always asked question, always ask questions. I always wanted to know more. I wanted to understand why we were here, what the point of all of this was. So I would always ask the questions and I was very open-minded. So while I practice the Catholic faith with my family, I was very open.
[00:14:40] So I think that's what allowed me to grow into a very spiritual person now. So I would say identify myself as a very spiritual person today, more than part of a very organized religion. But I do think having that foundation really was what sparked it. I always knew there's something bigger [00:15:00] than myself out there that this is more than this existence is just one part of this bigger and life story that we don't really know what what's out there, but it's something bigger and greater than all of us that connects all of us.
[00:15:13] And that awareness always gave me this. Freedom in a way I kind of removed the sphere from life and I always felt protected in this weird way. I never knew why, but as a child, I always felt protected and had the freedom to be who I wanted to be an explore wherever I wanted to go and do what I wanted to do.
[00:15:31] So I would say I am grateful that that was the foundation, but I do think that helped really propel my life forward and really figure out who I was and who I am today.
Sheba: [00:15:42] Well, and I also think Gen, like, you know, obviously we have different experiences, but also there's this like vein of similarity. And I think Sam, that is why we want you to create Mahara.
[00:15:54] So, you know, Gen and I were in these corporate careers for well over a decade each and [00:16:00] as amazing as those careers were and as much of a launch pad as they were to now build a business and have the skills that we need. I think both Gen and I really connected on this idea of like, We feel like this isn't it.
[00:16:15] And there was always this like, itch to do more and be mission-driven and to be of service. And you know, when Gen and I, because we've been on this journey most of our life, and I would say we really doubled down in the last decade of like really finding those mindfulness practices that worked for us.
[00:16:32] What we were noticing is like, we always felt like, yes, of course we went through anxiety and stress, but we had this place to go back to because we had these practices and what Gen and I were noticing is like, So many people around us, especially because we tend to have a lot of friends that are very driven and very ambitious.
[00:16:50] They didn't really know what to do with their stress and anxiety. And so what Gen and I said is like, for our next act, we really want to go full time into building our [00:17:00] brand and something that is bigger than us, as you said, Gen, but like is so meaningful. And we know it will move the meter for people.
[00:17:06] Like it will actually make a difference. Like we want Mahara to be a place where people come and they find practical ways to actually implement mindfulness into their life. Because I think it's such a buzzword out there and like often people are lost and they don't know what to like sink their teeth into and wanted it to be a safe place for people to come and be like, I could experiment with this.
[00:17:30] Like I could, this could be an introduction.
Genevive: [00:17:32] Yeah, it was really, that was the most key thing is we wanted it to be that stepping stone into a world of mindfulness practices. So it's not the be all and end all, but here's an entry point for you to try it out and try and see if this tool works for you. Our goal is to create more tools that allow people to just kind of test it, see if it feels good and if it does continue on this journey.
Sheba: [00:17:53] I think too, like, sorry, Sam one last thing is like, when, you know, for us, it was very important [00:18:00] that Gen and I never have said, you know, listen to us, we're guru's we're the experts. We just want to be the bridge to those practices that have helped us.
[00:18:10] And it's like, you can come here and find something that works for you. That is like our only mission. Do you know what I mean? Yeah.
Samantha: [00:18:17] Yeah. And there's not enough, there's not enough tools and resources for that stepping stone, as you said, Gen and Sheba ,but you've echoed it. There a lot of much more advanced tools and resources for those who are spiritual already that are out there. And I think they're extremely intimidating and uncertain, and it actually creates a barrier for entry and a resistance as well. And I think that's oftentimes a lot of people's resistance to mindfulness, to spirituality, and sometimes to religion is lack of understanding or ability to find an entry point that works for them.
[00:18:55] Yeah. Access and, you know, through, through the human [00:19:00] being journal. And I want to dive into like what the journal is, cause we've, we've spoken about, you know, your values as, as founders and Mahara mindfulness, but what does this journal allow a reader, a writer, a user of the journal to do. And, and what, you know, your goal is to really begin that sort of.
[00:19:20] Spark within someone and open their mind a little bit further, but tell us how that comes to practice with, with using the journal.
Sheba: [00:19:28] Yeah. So I can set the tone a little bit even to set up what the human being journalism, why Gen and I even decided to go that route. So when we quit our careers in February of 2020, we were going to build Mahara Mindfulness and we were actually going to launch with the vans and three weeks later, the pandemic hit.
[00:19:50] So we did a very hard pivot and. No, Gen and I, yeah, so that's like a journey in itself, but Gen and I got [00:20:00] super intentional and super quiet about like, what is it that the world actually needs right now that we can be of service and, you know, with mental health numbers, skyrocketing, and, you know, there were so many articles out with the globe and mail and the Atlantic talking about like, you know, people can't afford mental health treatments right now.
[00:20:19] Like just unemployment and, you know, they're the even getting therapists online. The virtual wait times were crazy. And so Gen and I really thought about in our own lives, like what were the practices that have really helped that are, that are research based like research shows. Journaling is so amazing for anxiety and stress, but also that are cost-effective.
[00:20:40] Gen and I had been avid journals our whole life. Like we've done all like guided bullet, all of this. And, you know, we always felt like there was something missing, like all these journals out there for us personally. And we always see ourselves as the consumer, right. Like if it would resonate with us, it would resonate with somebody else.
[00:21:00] [00:20:59] And so we always felt like journals out. There were kind of, you know, going all in on productivity or skimming the surface and hacking gratefulness. And for us like that, to us, it's like getting somewhere beautiful requires the time. Right. And so we kind of decided to go the journal guided journal route because it had worked for us.
[00:21:20] We just thought we could do it a little bit better. And we did a ton of market research and found that, you know, one of the reasons journaling is really hard for people is that it's as a daily practice, they can't keep up with it. And then, you know, once they miss a few days, they just throw the baby out with the bath water.
[00:21:36] So that was why it was a monthly journal for us. And then you know, we just, we, yeah, so that's how we decided, landed on doing the journal. And in terms of the actual theme, Gen, I know if you want to talk a little bit about how the human being journal came about for.
Genevive: [00:21:53] So the idea for the journal actually, the concept came about a few years ago when Sheba [00:22:00] and I, we spent about a week or so watching this webinars series that Oprah did with Eckhart Tolle on the new earth. And it was a really like pivotal moment for us. We were both going through a lot in our lives then, and we just committed to watching this webinar.
[00:22:15] And during that webinar, Eckhart talks about this concept, this human being concept and these two dimensions. And he talks about the human side of life, which is our earthly identifiers of success. So that's our career, our finances relationships. And then he speaks to the being side, which is really our true essence, which is timeless and formless.
[00:22:37] And that's our spirit and our mind. And. He just, he said it in a way that really clicked for us where it's, when you bridge both worlds, that's when you really are able to live a fulfilled life. And literally Sheba and I were sitting on the sofa, we call this, this our green sofa that we sit on, where ideas form.
[00:22:55] And we sat there and we both got up at the same time when he talked about this and you go, this [00:23:00] is so powerful. It's such a simple concept of what it means to be a human being. You can't really have one without the other. You really need to bring the two together in order to feel truly fulfilled in this existence.
[00:23:12] So that concept has been sitting with us for years and once the pandemic hit and we started ideating around this journal, We thought about what a fulfilled life really meant and what it meant to live a life with no regrets. If we were to look back 10 years from now, are we making sure we're checking in on ourselves and all the important things that really matter?
[00:23:33] And in our journal, you'll find we have 10 elements that we've outlined that us capture the essence of what it means to be fulfilled and to be, to be really, to really look at your life holistically and just check in on yourself on those things. And the journal guides you through those 10 elements every month, where we dive deeper into different questions that tap into relationships or your spirit, or your mind, or your career, and [00:24:00] our goal for people when they do the journal from start to finish is that they just get to know themselves better through this process.
[00:24:07] They get to understand their human side and their being side. Just a little bit better from what they were when they first started.
Sheba: [00:24:13] So, yeah, and I think the one thing I'd like to add there, and Gen and I both felt this time is that I think the reason, the concept so landed for us, like as soon as accurate talked about it, we both, it like resonated is because this idea that.
[00:24:30] You know, as human beings, like we're told, you know, there's this like blueprint of what a great life looks like. Right? And then you live out those things and there's always this like ache. There's always this like, feeling like, Oh, I got that promotion. Or I got that dream relationship. Or I moved to my dream city more.
Samantha: [00:24:47] I want more.
Sheba: [00:24:48] And there's always this like point at which it no longer satiates you. And it was when he said that you have to marry these concepts to actually feel [00:25:00] peace. And it landed in such a way. And the reason it landed for both of us is that it was a truth for us. And you can only like react to something in that way and deeply resonate when it already was something that you knew was your truth.
[00:25:14] And I was like, Oh my God, like, that's totally it because why are we always striving? Like, why is it never enough? Why is there always a point where like that unhappiness sets in? And it's because we are not taught that it's so much larger than these, like, as Gen was saying, these earthy identifiers it's it's are you of service?
[00:25:36] Are you giving back? What is like, what are your real deep passions? What are the things that you know, like. That no one can take away from you, but that you work on, what's your spirit saying to you? Are you paying attention to it? Like, so when that can, you know, when that can be married to also your dreams and your success, and of course, like, it's amazing to have goals and to achieve [00:26:00] them, but if it can be married together, that's where like real peace and contentment and fulfillment comes from and thoughts, where the human being journal was, was born.
Samantha: [00:26:08] And that's where the beauty comes from out of, out of those two, finding one another. You have that quote actually in here. I have it in front of me from, at Eckhart. What's funny is that I too, with my best friend listened to that series with Oprah and Eckhart from beginning to end. And I remember, I don't, I think you guys had video, I think they maybe turned it into a podcast after that over put out.
[00:26:32] Yeah. And it was like the whole series. Cause the series is actually all the way from 2008. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, I think she put it on and it must have been 2018, 17 maybe. And what I was going through at the time. Well, it resonated with me so much, and that began the shift of more mindfulness content and you know, much like the two of you on your journey.
[00:26:56] So I love that you brought that up, first of all, just cause [00:27:00] you mentioned Oprah, we need to talk about as we haven't given this little nugget out to our audience yet, but I believe Oprah magazine put you guys on the list for Oprah's healthy living list. Is that correct? Yes. That is insane for as well.
[00:27:15] Oprah. Oprah is just the Holy grail of pretty much everything. But especially as female entrepreneurs. So how did that even happen?
Genevive: [00:27:22] Like she is Sheba absolutely idol too. So this was like a huge moment. We were dying.
Sheba: [00:27:29] Oh, it's so, you know, it's so interesting. That like hearing someone else say it back to me is still so wild. And it's like, I think I will still need a minute to like, know that this happened Oprah for me. Like she's not a brand, she's like an institution. And like, I, you know, everybody says they love her. And I, you know, I know everybody loves her, but like, when I say love her, like, I mean, I would run home after school.
[00:27:58] I would watch her shows. [00:28:00] I have watched her interviews, like not on her show, like just her intro being interviewed. I have subscribed to her magazine for years. And she has been such a force when it came to like how my life unfolded. And it's so powerful because it's this person you've never met, but like they've just had such an impact.
[00:28:20] And so how it came about is actually, you know, It's not the most interesting part of the story, how it came about is like Gen and I have a background in PR and, you know, we pitch media all the time. And so we had sort of been pitching her team for some time and then, you know, it got into the right hands and I think they sent it up the chain and then one of their like main editors got back in touch with us and it was like, we love this concept.
[00:28:46] Can you tell us more? Can you send us images? And I think it just, you know, it, I mean, it's, it's so up the Oprah brand alley, but it was just such a full circle moment for me and Gen, because, you know, the whole [00:29:00] journal was like, it came from a conversation that she had. Right. It's just crazy. And it's such a Testament to the power of like manifestation and being aligned and being in flow.
[00:29:14] And like the Oprah brand has like so informed my life. So of course, and you know, I know Gen loves her too. Like, it's just, it's one of those things that like, when it happened, It was exciting and crazy and amazing, but also there was like such peace with it because I was like, it just, it feels like that would have happened.
[00:29:34] If that makes sense .
Genevive: [00:29:35] To what Sheba said. What's been really interesting throughout this whole experience is the magic that happens when you're in flow, when you're just aligned to your purpose and what you're meant to do, and you do it with pure, good intentions. And you come from that place. We've just every day, sometimes we'll be on the phone going to do you see this happened?
[00:29:57] Oh my God, this happened, what is going on in [00:30:00] our lives? And it's this ongoing dialogue. And we just realized now it's this magic that just comes together when you're doing is meaning it's pure alignment. So the Oprah, like now things are no longer a huge surprise. It's, we're completely grateful.
[00:30:17] And we still have crazy exciting moments and we both were crying and. We're excited, but it's just, it's just so incredible to witness that ourselves, the power that comes when you really do get to know yourself, you're aligned and you're doing something that's meaningful for the world. It's, it's incredible.
Samantha: [00:30:36] And, and also the fact that like so many people are trying to do this and don't know where to start and with your product, you two have aligned with your purpose, but you've now created a brand and a tangible product that helps people find their own. And it's just this, this flywheel effect, like we always talk about it in business is okay, we're feeding this flywheel and the flywheel is [00:31:00] bringing more of purpose and more passion, more reason to the consumer.
[00:31:07] And as a result of feeding back into the success of you, both as entrepreneurs and business, and it just, you know, it seems to, I'm sure certain people listening. It seems almost whimsical like impossible and. You don't really realize it until you try it, you know, until it begins to happen and you go, Oh, well, like you said, now, we don't even, we're not even surprised by stuff.
[00:31:29] It's, it's crazy. Cause you're in flow. What would you say to listeners besides get the human being journal and begin today, besides that? What would you say to our listeners that can begin to guide them through finding that process? You know, I guess aside from the journal.
Sheba: [00:31:50] Yeah. I mean, I can go first, Gen, if you know, it's, it's so interesting, cause I've always said that finding your way through life and [00:32:00] finding the things that work for you and figuring out a mindfulness practice is such a personal thing.
[00:32:04] And it's such a personal journey and I've always said that people need to get curious and figure out what works for them by experimenting. I would say from. If I was to like step away and like, we can of course talk about very specific practices later in this conversation. But if I was to step away, you know, for me, you know, mindfulness is such a buzzword, but you know, if for, if you break it down and I've always tried to do that for myself, cause I'm like, yeah, this is how this person defines it.
[00:32:33] But this is what it means for me. Like, it really is this idea of. Everything you do have so much awareness and presence and intentionality around it that you're like, so hyper present in that moment and you're not judging it. You're just letting life be a feedback loop. And, you know, recently just to like illustrate this.
[00:32:54] So like, you know, when I go down and see my parents once a week, I'm like fully there. Like I am with my parents [00:33:00] when I'm having this conversation with you, Sam and you, Gen, like I am here when I'm having a conversation about business with Gen. That is where I am. When I am driving down to my parents' place in the car with my sister, we are there and talking or listening to a podcast.
[00:33:14] And so what I had found is that when you. Like how you practice deep listening when it comes to your life. It's always speaking to you. And like, even just recently, I've really gotten into a certain type of meditation called yoga nidra cause a really good friend of mine does it as an instructor.
[00:33:33] And what yoga nidra is is that, that point of like, it takes you just to sleep state, but you're still like very aware when certain, you know, you, you do body scans and you, you see how you feel. And so in this session there was a point in it. So it's about 30 minutes in the last 10 minutes. She actually started talking about these four lines, these affirmations, and I'm trying to remember what they were.
[00:33:58] So one was, I have [00:34:00] everything I need. The second one was I'm open to life's abundance. The third one was I'm inherently worthy. And the fourth one was what is for me, will not miss me. And what she made us do is like, she kept saying it because the thing is when things like that happen at first, you just intellectualize it.
[00:34:21] Right. But like she kept saying it until you felt it in your body. And what she made us do is she said, as you say, each of those affirmations, see how your body feels, like, see how you actually respond to it. And guys, it was so powerful because you know, with the, I have everything I need, I was great with the, what is for me will not miss me.
[00:34:43] I was great with the, like, I'm open to life abundant, I was great. And then the, I am inherently worthy. I had this moment where like, I could feel a resistance. Right. And it was like paying attention because what life and what [00:35:00] it is trying to tell me is there is something there still to heal. And if there's no judgment of it, because we're all on a process of like healing and being better and being our best selves.
[00:35:11] But it was like this moment of like, that is an analogy for life. Like if you were paying attention down to that granular level of like how even your body or your left leg or resist that, like that is like, that is the Mecca of figuring out the direction of your life. And so even for me in Gen, like, you know, coming to Mahara, wasn't just this like random business decision we made a year ago because we wanted to leave our corporate gigs.
[00:35:40] It has been us paying attention throughout our life, to the things that mattered, paying attention that we want our life to be of service, paying attention, to the things that worked for us. And that's how you get aligned. And it's so crazy because everybody thinks it's this like secret, but it's not it's like, it's, you're [00:36:00] constantly like learning that.
Samantha: [00:36:02] So. I want to share with everyone listening, where can they find you? Because you also have, there's just so many exciting things you've like launched a month ago, right? About two months ago, a little over two months ago. Yeah. That's crazy. That just shows how talented you both are in PR and communications of where you've come in the past.
[00:36:22] I feel like we've already been speaking for two months. But so you guys are recently doing a deal with Indigo if I'm correct. Right. So it's, you'll be able to purchase the human being journal on indigo.com or in store.
Genevive: [00:36:35] Yeah. It's already online. So you can go purchase it right now across Canada and in stores the spring.
[00:36:41] So all their major flagship stores, which is huge. We're so excited. It's actually a really funny story because Sheba and I, in 2019, we actually walked by the Indigo store in Toronto up in Blore and we stood outside and we took a photo. We stopped and we said, We're [00:37:00] going to be in that store one day, took a photo.
[00:37:02] We sent it to this chat, WhatsApp talk that we have, and then like another full circle moment. Similar to that Oprah piece is that now we just closed this deal and we looked back at that photo and we're just, we're just an amazement at what is possible when you put it out into the world. Like, it is really magic in its own way. You just have to believe and put it out there. And I'm more than that. You do have to do the hard work to get there as well, but it's just, it's just having that mindset, that abundance mindset and really believing.
Samantha: [00:37:37] And don't you find when you believe the hard work stops being work, it just starts like, you know, it's still just as hard, you're up late hours, but you never have the doubt in the back of your mind.
[00:37:50] And that's really a hard thing to drop you. Can't just say I'm going to stop doubting myself or I'm going to stop questioning my choices and it's a muscle, right? [00:38:00] Like you can't, you can't be really fit and then it just stays for the rest of it. I wish that was the case. You have to continue to keep it up.
[00:38:08] Yeah. You know, continue to take care of that muscle. And our mind is the exact same, but when you start believing that you're in alignment, it stops being work. It stops being pressure to force something one way or another and more navigating life along the way.
Sheba: [00:38:28] Yeah. Well, and it's interesting too, because you know, one of the people we love to follow is Michael Beckwith. And he has this episode on SuperSoul series where he talks about like, you know, if life in the universe is always a feedback loop, you know, when you are in alignment and Gen and I talked about this all the time, you know, it, because all the things from the outside that look like luck and look like serendipity and look like a coincidence.
[00:38:56] It's not, it's just like these things are happening [00:39:00] because you are on path and You know, hard work and putting out good products or having good content is table stakes, right? It's like, what is the next layer? And, and when you feel guided and in alignment, those things just sort of show up and like help you sort of take it to the next level.
Samantha: [00:39:22] Having the courage to move towards that as well as a big piece of it, because, you know, we can feel that, but it's still equally as scary. It's, you know, I've spoken about in the past how vulnerability is learned. It's like the more that we exercise that the stronger it gets and the stronger our intuition gets, and we are able to, you know, drop our fear and proceed with love. But if we don't take that, that chance, then we, can't one thing that you, you said just before, as you were speaking about when we're in alignment, we [00:40:00] know, and like, it doesn't look like luck anymore, even what we, not just necessarily to ourselves, but what we see around us, what's also unique.
[00:40:07] And I want to hear, if you, if either of you two have had similar experiences when we know what alignment means, and we live most of our life in alignment in the moments, we're not, we are still as aware that we are not. Right and it's not, no, I have a bad feeling. This is not for me, but more okay. You know, this month I'm, I've gone astray.
[00:40:29] I know I've, I've sort of lost my way in certain path and now I can find my way back. And how has that experience unfolded for either of you I'm sure in your past work or past jobs also, but I'd love to hear about that.
Genevive: [00:40:43] I would say definitely in our, like for me personally, I can say if I've been in the wrong role too, or I've been in a job for too long right away, you just kind of, you feel it, you start getting antsy and you start feeling it in your body and you know, something is [00:41:00] off and something is wrong and you you're, I feel like your body tells you and your mind tells you when you're not in alignment.
[00:41:08] And if you pay attention, you know, you know, that it's time to change course or redirect to end. I feel like that's one of the main reasons we even left our corporate careers and started Mahara. It was time. Everything was pointing to change course. You're not in, you're not aligned, you don't feel fulfilled.
[00:41:27] And even when you're working really hard, you feel more exhausted. So like you said, when you're in alignment and in flow, you have all this energy and you're putting in the same amount of hours and time, but you're still energized and ready to do more. Whereas when you're not, it's a sign when you feel completely defeated and you don't want to get up the next day to work that hard.
[00:41:48] It's another sign. So there's, I feel like life is constantly giving you these signs to tell you when you need to redirect yourself to get back on course. And when you're back on course, you somehow [00:42:00] get this renewed sense of purpose and fulfillment as you start to do what you do. I'm sure Sheba, we talk about this a lot.
[00:42:08] I know, even, I think in Mahara. As you were navigating through Mahara and what we wanted to do, we had those moments where things didn't work the way you wanted it to, and when we'd reflect and we go, wait, this is why let's like, go back to what our mission is and what our vision is. And let's continue to always use that as our North star, because it'll keep us in going in the right direction.
Sheba: [00:42:32] Yeah. I mean, you know, one of my favorite quotes or something I've read in a book that's always stayed with me is this thing that Elizabeth Gilbert says where she says, you know, real change happens when you get sick of your own shit. And I think that's great, she's great. And she's like a master in vulnerability and just putting it out there and letting it hang.
[00:42:56] And, you know, I think I've [00:43:00] always tried to be a very intentional person. There's many times in life where you fall short. I would say that, you know, before I made the move to Mahara. I'd had you know, a communications career for 13 years, I can say in full honesty that I stayed at that party three years too long.
[00:43:19] And I knew it and it takes a tremendous amount of honesty and stillness and repetitive honesty with yourself to be like, I have to get out of this. I am so unhappy. And I think part of the struggle for people is including myself. When I found myself there is that. You know, it's this healthy paycheck on paper.
[00:43:42] You should be happy. You know, you buy into that lie, because you should be grateful. That's what everyone around you is telling you, but like, you cannot lie to yourself when you go to bed at night and you're like, I am not aligned. Like this does not make me feel [00:44:00] any which way alive. And I know it, and there comes a point where as Elizabeth Gilbert study, you get sick of your own shit.
[00:44:07] And for me, it was like sick of the, like dialogue in my head where I knew, and I had to stop like pretending. And I had to get really honest with myself. And you know, when you've also had a career for that long, like a change at that point seems really scary. And I think everybody waits for like all these ducks to line up, but like, the ducks don't all line up.
[00:44:33] Like you have to free fall and then you line the ducks off in hindsight, like you make the choice. Right. But you have to really, to your point, Sam, when you even ask the question, you have to get vulnerable because it's only through vulnerability where you can actually get honest enough to say I'm not happy.
[00:44:52] And that's really hard for people, right? Like, it's really hard to say, you're not happy because you should, on the outside, you [00:45:00] should be. And so now actually, as Gen and I have built this company over the last year, and yes, we only launched two and a half months ago, but we've been working on it since March because I was unhappy in my career. Like only a year ago but, I am so sensitive to that feeling.
[00:45:20] Samantha: [00:45:20] Oh girl, same it's been longer for me now but, I know when you get that feeling, you almost break out into hives. Like don't put me back there.
[00:45:31] Sheba: [00:45:31] Totally. And so again, like going back to our theme in this whole conversation about paying attention, like, I am so sensitive to that feeling and it goes beyond my career, right?
[00:45:41] Like who is in my life? Like it are the people in the energies around me serving me and bringing me peace and vice versa is the work Gen and I are doing. Is it intentional? Is there a North star? Is there a greater mission? Like, you know, how am I treating my body? Like how [00:46:00] old, what is the food I'm putting in there?
[00:46:02] Right. Like all of it to me is like, is like, I. And I love being in this space because I love that I am so in touch with that feeling, that I knew that that feeling that I don't ever want to go back to, it was such a lesson and it is such a, like, it will always course correct.
Genevive: [00:46:23] Yeah and to add to that, I think once you're aware of that feeling, the next big question, you have to ask yourself as. What is it that you want and what is it that you need? And I think that's always the other hard part, cause there's, a lot of times I'll have conversations with people. They just feel uncomfortable and they want this change, but then you have to say, well, tell me what, what do you want the be very, and that's what takes the time.
[00:46:47] And the work is reflect on what matters to you because no one's like everyone has a different definition of what success means to them. And you have to know what that means to you. Be very clear with that because it's [00:47:00] only when you can ask that and get intentional about that, that you can start to see real change in your life and start to really direct yourself in the way that you want to go.
Sheba: [00:47:11] And I would also say that, you know, it's interesting because alignment is this funny thing is like the longer you stay in that space, the quicker you're able to get back on course. But I would say that. You know, part of me reaching a place in my life where I've never felt more satisfied in my career, I've never felt more aligned.
[00:47:34] And I know Gen and me have talked about this. We'll continue to hopefully feel that way. But I think one of the really important things is the unlearning that needs to happen. So, you know, for me, for 13 years, I w I worked in an agency space. I worked with teams. I always had people to bounce ideas off, and then suddenly, you know, me and Gen found ourselves to be like, [00:48:00] full-time entrepreneurs, a pandemic.
[00:48:02] We didn't see each other all the time. There was no structure, none of that. And so. You know, it took me a minute, right. To be like, okay, how am going to get comfortable? And how am I going to stay aligned? And I think for me, what, and again, Gen, this goes back to what you were saying. It's like asking yourself those questions of like, why do I need?
[00:48:23] And so very early, I was able to identify that, you know, what I need to feel aligned is I need little wins. And what I mean by that is like, I think, you know, we're taught that like, You know, moonshots are, what matter? Like we're seduced by these odd dashes, like big goals in life. But actually that, isn't the stuff that sets you up to feel aligned and do the right work.
[00:48:52] What sets you up is like the little wins, right? So like every day, like Gen and I have this, like overwhelming to do it, but we [00:49:00] always touch base and we're like, okay, these are the things we really have to do. And this will feel like success in this will feel like we're on the path. And for me, what I realized is like, you know, those times where you're feeling like not your best or you're procrastinating, or you don't feel aligned, but you know, you have to get back to the work is like, I have found that like, unlike what people think, which is like belief precedes action.
[00:49:27] It's actually the other way around, right? Like it's doing the work and having the small wins that keep you on course that keep you aligned that keep you feeling like you're winning. And I think that has that to me is my like course correcting that. Like I never want to feel the way I did. And this is how I stay aligned is like, I focus on the now and I focus on a little wins. And so, you know, when Indigo happens or Oprah happens, those are exciting, but those were just outcomes. They weren't part of the [00:50:00] everyday journey, right.
Samantha: [00:50:03] Besides the photo and your manifestation, at the end of the day, you weren't showing up to work for that, to be your goal, you were showing up because of your list that you knew you had to do, and you broke it down to your small wins.
[00:50:17] Yeah, I was just going to say, like, what would you say to, what do you say to the work that has to get done, but there's no way it's a win. Do you know those parts of it that are, there's always some of that. And I think some people listening may feel like, okay, this all sounds like once I got into alignment, it's all sparkly and free flows and just works out.
[00:50:42] And there's still these really uncomfortable things that have to happen and have to be done or work that has to be done that you don't enjoy. How do you get through that while still highlighting those wins?
Genevive: [00:50:55] Well, we've had a lot of those, I'll tell you. We had [00:51:00] the funniest story where we, so we had all these journals coming in and this is a COVID environment.
[00:51:06] So everything you're limited to how much help you can get from people. There's two of us fully bootstrapping this business. I had just moved into an apartment in Toronto, no elevator, three flights of stairs. And we got our first journal delivery. And this is the first time we've ever done a business like this.
[00:51:24] So we have thousands of journals and hundreds of boxes that arrive at my doorstep Sheba, and I literally work hustling, carrying all these boxes up the stairs. My apartment is now a mini warehouse that we then are kind of navigating through. And we look at ourselves and we were like, what is happening?
[00:51:46] What are we doing? But then you, we just look at each other and figure out, okay. Let's take a moment and go, okay, this is what it is. This work has to get done. We always try to somehow find the bright side of it. Cause it's a [00:52:00] means to this bigger end, we know that this is all part of the journey that it's part of the hustle that we have to get through it.
[00:52:07] It's part of our story and you kind of in a way, talk yourself through that, the little things that just have to get done and you do it. And it's not easy. And there's moments where we do have breakdowns and we're frustrated and tired and we, but we just somehow have to talk ourselves through it and just know that this is all part of that bigger journey.
[00:52:30] Sheba: [00:52:30] Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I that's, I totally echo those sentiments, Gen. And I think, you know, I heard this thing ages ago that I thought was amazing is like this idea of like you pick your struggle, right? So you pick, everybody has problems. Pick better problems, right? So it's like this idea of like, you can go to the gym and you're not going to want to go to the gym, but you go to the gym and you get those results and you [00:53:00] feel healthy.
[00:53:00] You feel more alive, or you can pick the other struggle, which is like not go to the gym, sit and watch Netflix. And then eventually have that sedentary lifestyle where you don't feel good and you don't feel healthy. So it's like the idea like Gen, as you were saying, like hauling those boxes and you know, it's, it's not easy. No, one's helping us. It's hard. It's, you're in the suck of it, but you're picking the struggle because the struggle inform something larger. And I think for me, what's also just like sometimes I think, you know, people get on podcasts and we talk about all these things, but there's nothing practical. What I found has really helped in those days where Gen and I have administrative stuff and it's not fun and exciting.
[00:53:40] We're not pitching media and we're not doing all the like literally glittery fun. You know, stuff is like, there's this thing I heard on a podcast like a year ago and it was just five more. So this, I can't remember his name, but he came on a podcast and he had an acronym acronym for it. And it [00:54:00] was just J five app.
[00:54:02] And he was like, you know, when you are reading a book and you're just like, I'm tired. I don't want to read those, but I probably should. It's like just read five more pages. And when you read five more pages, guess what you end up reading 20. And when your inbox is like overflowing and you're just like overwhelmed, it's like, okay, just apply the rule. We'll just get through five emails. And then by the end of it, you realize you've gone through like seven or eight and it's goes back to the idea of like the little wins, right? Like just do the small thing. Do the task in front of you and tomorrow will take care of itself. So yes, running a business and running a startup is not glamorous.
[00:54:43] There's a ton of stuff that like social media will never see like 99% of Gen and my day is not glamorous or sexy, but, and, and again, you know, the things that we. Ended up being the wins and that tons of people message us about are such a [00:55:00] small part of our day. And frankly, by the time we've announced it, we've already known about it for like three months.
[00:55:06] So it's like, we're kind of like onto the next thing. And so I think it is to answer your question, Sam, it's just about like breaking it down and realizing that it's serving a larger end purpose
Genevive: [00:55:19] And tell you about too that, Oh, sorry, go ahead.
Samantha: [00:55:22] And I'm finding joy every day in those tasks, right? Like you said, you know, you've already celebrated it and, and celebrating each little piece each day.
Sheba: [00:55:32] Yeah. Yeah,
Genevive: [00:55:33] I was just going to add, cause I recently read something too, that really resonated it's this whole idea, going back to the small wins that create that ripple effect and you get more motivated because a lot of times people wait to be motivated to act. So they're waiting for this thing to drive them to do something.
[00:55:51] But what's really interesting is to start doing the little things and then that's what really motivates you to do so much more. And it's just this mindset shift that [00:56:00] has to take place. And once it does, it's so powerful when you start to enact that in your day-to-day.
Sheba: [00:56:05] Yeah. And that's exactly the idea of like belief doesn't proceed actions actually, it's the other way round.
[00:56:12] And if you can understand that and that like, like action has its own sort of magic and momentum and like you can lean into it. If you just get, you know, dive into the first five things. It's that simple. Yep.
Samantha: [00:56:26] What is one thing each of you ladies would tell our audience today to get started on their business?
Sheba: [00:56:37] Like if they had an idea and they've been sitting on it. Yeah.
Samantha: [00:56:43] Or what would you say to yourself a year ago or a year and a half ago? Maybe that's easier.
Genevive: [00:56:48] I would say when Sheba and I ,we've been wanting to create this business for a while. And what really made us act was we sat down and we said, let's make a decision. Are we going to do this or not? And we said, yes, we're going to do [00:57:00] this. And then we're like, okay, what is the barrier that's holding us from getting started? So we sat down and actually wrote down, okay, this is the thing that's holding a stock. And then we wrote down an action plan. We said, we need to do X, Y, and Z in the next six months in order to fit our jobs, to be in a financial place where we can do this and get started.
[00:57:19] So it was really making the commitment and saying, we're going to do this, identifying that barrier that was holding us back and then creating that action plan and fast forward six months, pandemic hit and are action plan maybe went out the window, but it got us started. It got us going and it started to help us start to put the things in motion that needed to happen to build the business.
Samantha: [00:57:43] I didn't stop you. It shifted you exactly.
Sheba: [00:57:46] Yeah. I would say that that is very practical advice and I totally stand behind it because ,that's what Gen, you and I did. I would say from a more philosophical point of view, I would say, decide, [00:58:00] and then the universe will make room for it. I think the hardest thing, and this is why like the Alchemist is one of my favorite books is, I think there's so much power in decision.
[00:58:13] And when you decide beautiful things happen, but it's when you're on that train of in decisiveness that like the universe isn't making room for it because you haven't actually fully committed. And I think for Gen and I, as we've mentioned a few times now on this podcast, like Mahara was an idea. We launched you for a long time.
[00:58:33] Then it manifested into an actual idea, like two years before we quit. And then we did it. But the beautiful things that have happened once we decided, and we jumped, it's like, you know, like I could never, ever have predicted them. And it is the power of making the choice. So anyone who has been sitting, you know, and obviously there's a certain amount of time that you have to sit with an idea before you, like, I'm not saying like, [00:59:00] quit your job tomorrow and do this.
[00:59:01] But if you've been sitting and stewing on an idea long enough, decide, and it will move you in some direction and it may not be your final destination, which it often isn't, but it will be the next best thing for you and believe in the conviction of your decision and because then the universe will.
Genevive: [00:59:24] Exactly. And that just that piece of step back is to just know what it is that you want, because the universe doesn't know what to give you. If you aren't asking the universe for what it is you want. So be very clear and deciding the thing too.
Sheba: [00:59:38] Though, I agree with that, but I also disagree with it, Gen, because sometimes you don't have to know the perfect decision. You just have to decide like there have been. So listen, I've been in relationships where. I have ended things, even though I loved the person and I wasn't sure, but I was like, at some point I need to make a decision. And [01:00:00] in hindsight, all of those decisions have been amazing and I would never have changed them, but there does come a point even if, even if it is not the next best thing.
[01:00:09] And you know, for sure it's the right decision, just decide.
Genevive: [01:00:13] Yeah, I understand what you mean. I think that what I'm saying is from the perspective of what do you want from your life, like tell the universe, this is what I envisioned my life to be and articulate that very clearly, because once you have that clear idea and that vision, then that you get to that point where you will be able to make that decision.
[01:00:33] And it's, I agree, like you have no idea where that decision is going to take you, but you're actually then very intentional about the course that you're taking.
Samantha: [01:00:43] That's beautiful. Finally, can you share with our audience where they can find you you've shared so much goodness, in this episode, I'm sure they're going to want to find, I'm going to link everything below in the show notes, as well as the human being journal through, through the best link to access it, [01:01:00] but share with everyone where they can continue to follow the human being journal, as well as you both, because you're such inspiring entrepreneurs and I'm certain that, you know, everyone listening will want more of that.
Sheba: [01:01:12] Sure. So you can follow us on Instagram at Mahara Mindfulness. Our website is maharamindfulness.com. You can also follow me personally on Instagram, even though I'm private. I will, you know, I definitely add people. It's Sheba Zaidi so S H E B A Z A I D I .
Genevive: [01:01:35] Yeah, and for me, my personal one, I'm also private , but I do follow some people. So it's a Genevieve Sav. So G E N E V I V E S A V on Instagram.
Samantha: [01:01:47] Perfect. And I will link those also. Everyone can continue. I want to thank both of you ladies for being here with me and sharing so much insight and being vulnerable in this conversation and telling your story. I [01:02:00] know that you've inspired so many of our listeners today and you've inspired me as well. You've, you've sort of reminded me of so many things that we forget when we're in it, like on the day-to-day and you've put me back on, like, I'm going back and listening to all these Eckhart and Oprah Interviews and getting back into, you know, your why and your purpose and your alignment. So thank you. Both of you, Gen and Sheba for being here.
Sheba: [01:02:25] Well, thank you for having us. And can I just say that I know we haven't met in person and I know we follow you, but I have always said, like, I always feel your energy comes through and I know how much you care about your community. And Gen and I are very excited when this is all over to actually meet you for a glass of wine.
Genevive: [01:02:44] Totally, it's so funny because Sam, Sheba and I independently saw something that you posted on one of your stories.
[01:02:52] And we both felt exactly the same. And we were like, we love her because she posted something about really being an authentic [01:03:00] person and influencer and brand and how it's so important when you support other businesses. That you're true to what you say and what you do. And we both independently saw this and later on had this conversation, we're talking about all these influencers and content creators, and we're like, we really liked her.
[01:03:17] She saw authentic and true to her, what she stands for. And it sometimes is very what we've noticed through this Mahara experiences. It's very clear who is really, really out there to make a difference in very intentional and authentic and really appreciate what you put out there and what you're sharing. So thank you.
Samantha: [01:03:38] Yeah. I'm like almost going to go to come to tears because honestly, as a creator, it's very difficult. It's like very difficult to anticipate how it's not difficult to be authentic. It's difficult to anticipate how the receiving end of it hears it or interprets it. And there obviously are moments where things get like [01:04:00] mixed signals or, you know, lines get crossed.
[01:04:02] And as you know, through my experience in the years, it gets easier. But. It's hard sometimes you're like, I just want to make sure that this comes out the way I'm intending it to. I know every business entrepreneur and everyone feels that way, but especially when you're continuously pumping out content you need to like refine HPC. You ladies are so sweet.
Sheba: [01:04:22] That's why I think it's important for you to know that, because I think when you're a content creator, you're doing it so alone and in a silo that you don't always get the feedback. And we're just saying that both of us are witnessing you and we love what you're doing and we send it all the way back.
Samantha: [01:04:38] So thank you. And the feeling's mutual, and I'm only a little jealous that you both have each other.
Sheba: [01:04:44] You can reach at any time if you want to chat.
Samantha: [01:04:48] Seriously this glass of wine is happening, even if it's summer, outside distance. It's going to happen. Well, thank you ladies. [01:05:00] .